December 16, 2003 | View Comments (18) | Category: Our Thoughts
Summary: Maybe it is just me, but the web seems to be lacking some design resources.
I have this need to acquire knowledge during almost every second of my life. When I began designing it was easy for me to go to sites and learn new things. Everyday was a new challenge because I knew I had to tackle something different, whether it was learning XHTML or CSS or good IA fundamentals. The problem is these things really don't have that much to do with learning how to design. It is easy to say the best way to learn is to practice and although this is true, I can't help but feel there could be some better resources out there on the web.
Maybe the whole Independent Web is a resource all on its own. You can learn almost anything you want through this amazing network. But how do I learn design? I wish more designers would share their thoughts on how they do design. Some of the best reads this year for me have come when a designer finishes a site and then writes a useful summary of what they were thinking during each stage of development. I think these are the most helpful resources to people. However, these seem to come far and few between.
When it comes to coding we are all quick to share how we accomplished something, but design seems to be one of those things we tell people that they need to put the work in to understand. There is no easy path to learning how to design, but the path could be easier if more of us shared our thoughts. I don't mean come up with idea, do it in Photoshop, use CSS, and publish. What I mean is why did you decide to use blues here and how did that layout and structure come to your mind? Insightful commentary on designs. Hmmm, I just came up with an idea. Do you think it would work to make it optional for designers who submit their works to the Vault to write a short summary/article on why they made certain decisions? Of course everyone wouldn't want to do that, but even if it only happened a couple times a month I think it would be helpful to many. I would love to hear your thoughts on this.
With that in mind, are there any resources or things that you would like to see more on the web to help you design? How can the web become even a better resource? Just to add to it are there any articles you would like to see written on a certain topic?
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Speaking of, just about 2 weeks ago, I dug through all of my countless bookmarks and organized a "Web Resources" section of my website. I would hope that something like this can help.
http://www.skyzyx.com/resources/
Ryan Parman (http://www.skyzyx.com)
Another reference I'd like aside from "How to design" is "How to pick fonts."
What are some guidelines for matching a fonts to a layout? What's the process involved in that absolutely perfect font for a site's header?
On second thought, this might just be one category that fits within the larger heading called "Design."
Overall, I think most of the resources on the web regarding CSS et. all are about the science of web design and not the art of web design.
Ben Kimball (http://www.benwired.com/)
I've wondered about this myself, it's not so much how people arrive at their decisions that fascinates me, but why?
Incidentally, one of my favourite design resources at:
http://www.d.umn.edu/itss/support/Training/Online/webdesign/
covers an awful lot of stuff.
Andy (http://branchleft.co.uk/)
I agree, and I would love to publish more in-depth interviews, tutorials and articles on these kinds of things. The problem is, most of the time the designer can not be found. For example, who did the inital design for Amazon and why did they use that color? Etc. Tracking them down is part of the problem. The other part of the problem is, once I have pinned them down and interviewed them, they often don't feel like communicating that level of depth about their designs for several reasons. First, design can be interprited in many ways... think of how many people can "see" things in the hand painted pinstipes on hot rods? What about any form of art? Color, shape and compostition mean so many different things to different people. I think another reason why designers don't communicate the details is because there either isn't any (i donno why I choose orange, it just looked good), or they are imbarrased (I chose orange because Zeldman used it and it looks cool). The ego thing is a huge problem with designers... no one excluded here. You have to have an ego to design, otherwise everything would just end up in the wastebasket. I am open to any thoughts you might have on how to get this level of depth from designers about their sites. Maybe we could lead by example?
Nick (http://www.digital-web.com)
Well I was going to post my article today about the redesign of this site, but I saw that I could get a little more indepth into what my thoughts were. I have no problems with sharing my design thoughts (or lack thereof) because how do we gain knowledge without sharing?
Scrivs (http://www.9rules.com/whitespace/)
I keep a list of web design resources on my old website though I admit I haven't updated it for a while and it could use some design changes; anyway, here's the page:
http://www.kayodeok.btinternet.co.uk/favorites/webdesign.htm
Kayode Okeyode (http://www.kayodeok.co.uk/weblog/)
Don't mean to toot my own horn, but with Zelnox's first comment I just couldn't resist. Last week I launched my own little CSS resource site, http://www.DailyStandards.com. I plan to post only standards oriented sites every weekday and to take it _much_ further than just the same old picture and a link kind of idea. So far, I've included a small write up and a quick list of stats for each site: whether or not the site validates as XHTML or CSS, approximate page size, links to CSS files, problems (as far as I can tell) and hacks used. My intention is to make it a searchable, daily resource that people/designers can go to to either get inspiration, learn a few things from other sites, or convince bosses/clients that CSS/XHTML is the way to go. So anyway, shameless self-promotion done with. As you were.
*cough* http://www.DailyStandards.com *cough*
Adam (http://www.dailystandards.com)
I'd be willing to write stuff about how I came up with the design of Overcaffeinated (it's already in the CSSVault). I'll do that and post it in my site, actually. Sounds like a good idea. If you want to use something like that, you could send me guidelines or stuff to work with.
I think Nick's also right about the shame thing. I don't consider myself a designer. I don't have formal education on that area. I usually just lurk reading the stuff the chaps at SpeakUp say because I don't have that much background. So explaining the details behind a design is somewhat difficult.
And then there's the influence.
We all look at other people's sites. We all are influenced by them. We get elements that work from someone else's sites and use them in our own. And sometimes we are the only ones who see the influence but it's a secret shame to admit it. But that's part of outlining your design process.
So, let me know if you're interested. If you send me rough guidelines it would be easier for me to come up with something postable.
sergio (http://overcaffeinated.net)
Does anyone know of any great sites/tutorials/books about those arch tools of design, Photoshop and Illustrator?
I love simple, minimalist sites (like this one, and 37signals), but I'm constantly amazed by beautiful sites like Bigha's -- http://www.bigha.com/ (by way of 37s/svn) How did Ernest Kim create the tabs, drop-shadows, masked photos, etc.?
Jacob Patton (http://www.freetheslaves.net)
Adam: It just seems your site is like the Vault, but you add a couple more words and see if it is valid or not. From my experience from the vault just to tell it is going to be a lot of work. Best of luck man.
Sergio: I am sure I can come up with some pretty good guidelines I think. Lemme see what I can do.
Scrivs (http://www.9rules.com/whitespace/)
I'm actually in the process of writing articles on selecting and mixing typefaces and that designing isn't about the process but more along the lines of inspiration and understanding. Creativity is not easy to pin down and dissect. Explaining how you come up with a certain creations is not easy and could possibly be pointless but why you opted for a particular solution can be defended.
Resources I find good for strengthening and inspiring my creative design skills are the following sites:
http://www.cobaltrevolter.net/
http://www.creativebehavior.com/
http://www.guigalaxy.com/
http://www.k10k.net/
http://www.pixelsurgeon.com/
http://www.scene360.com/
http://netdiver.net/
http://www.boxesandarrows.com/
http://www.benetton.com/colors/
Egor Kloos (http://www.dutchcelt.nl/weblog/)
There is a really good article from a couple of months ago in Boxes and Arrows concerning Interface design and natural colors.
Under their "Methods and Approaches" category, read the "Natural Selections..." article. I think it addresses your post quite well.
Mark Fusco (http://www.lightpierce.com/ltshdw)
Someone asked about Photoshop. You can check out:
http://www.teamphotoshop.com
http://www.phong.com
Zelnox
http://www.designdojo.ca/entries/dissecting.html
That is an example of something useful.
Scrivs (http://www.9rules.com/whitespace/)
Nick:
You mentioned that it's possible designers don't say too much about their work because there may not be any real reason behind their choices. I think a more likely reason is that many designers have a hard time expressing what they envision in their heads.
I for one, am more graphic designer than web developer. Visual design is where my heart is. However, it has taken me a few years to be able to "express" my vision. Hours, upon hours, of explaining my designs to clients have developed that skill. I am still no great writer. To put together the article for DesignDojo, I really had to think about "how" to say it. I can definitely "see" it. To be honest, the article isn't all that well written...but hey, it's a start.
I normally have very distinct reasons why I make certain decisions during the design process. But after doing it over and over again, those desicions become second nature...unconcious sometimes. When that happens, you sometimes forget why exactly you did something. You feel as if there is "no real reason" behind choosing orange other than it looked cool.
Sergio:
Incorporating designs from other works is not a secret shame. There is not a single designer on the planet that has not been influenced by another. Ask any of them. David Carson. Paul Rand. You name 'em, I guarantee they had influences they incorporated into their own work.
Remember, design is just another branch of art. And art is 100% based upon either following those who came before, or going in the complete opposite direction. Classical artists were trained to mimic the great ones. It was considered an honour to be picked by a reputable artist (Michael Angelo, say) and to train to paint, sculpt, design, just as they did.
They key is to borrow ideas and then make them your own. Not a straight cut and paste, but a version, or interpretation. When you start out, you need to practice sometimes by recreating excatly what others have done, as a learning technique...just never claim it as completely your own or mass publish it. After some time, you develop a style and voila...you're a designer.
Sam (http://www.designdojo.ca)
You know I often set out to document in some way my design or development processes and I find that it is quite a bit easier said than done.
When I'm designing or developing a solution I'm not usually thinking about how I can explain it to someone. There is quite a bit of experimentation and trial and error that goes into my work -- how do you articulate that?
Then there is the matter of time. Much of time time is spent doing actual work -- and I find it hard to set aside enough time to get my thoughts together to explain a particular project and when I finally do I can't always remember what it is I did to get from point A to point B.
Nick makes a great point about ego. Let's face it -- much of what we do as designers is driven by ego. If we're luck it's our ego, not our clients. ;) I think one of the reason for the current outburst of redesigns is in part because of this very reason. Ego and the urge to create.
Many designers might not want to admit they're using their clients time and money to get creative and work on their "art"...
How many times have you seen a great looking site that is completely off the mark as far as it's audience? This is where ego comes in to play.
Some designers don't understand that users come to the site not to see, say, your amazing skills with Flash, rather they come to learn about your client's products.
Anyway, I would love to see more of the kind of resources Scrivs is talking about. If only great designers were better writers, had more time and felt comfortable speaking openly about their work.
Keith (http://www.7nights.com/asterisk/)
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#1
What I would like is a quick repository of CSS patterns categorized. In a way, a bit like welie's web patterns http://www.welie.com/patterns/.
Sometimes we stumble upon a weird or obscure bug that requires Google's help. Sometimes, we don't ask the right words to describe it, so Google does not understand. A list of patterns can help or, a list of problems even.
Of course, I would like to see more table-less design. The CSSVault is an example. However, it is not at same level as linkdup or moluv yet in terms of quantity, probably because of the lack of good table-less sites.
It seems right now, the developer has to do the work of accumulating these resources himself (or herself). I do not think most developers have the time to sort their bookmarks to manage them properly. And we are not talking about checking if the resource is still available.
I love Sun's Java API online doc, but I also find MSDN's code samples indispensable. Now, if only CSS could have something like that. Maybe there is, but I am not aware of. (-_-);;;;
Maybe something beyond glish and bluerobot.
Zelnox