January 19, 2005 | View Comments (18) | Category: Our Thoughts
Summary: Is holding a contest with a low-price prize devaluing design or providing an ample opportunity for someone new to get their career started?
My buddy Greg is hosting a contest. The contest entails having to create a logo for a real company and submitting it. The logo that is chosen wins an iPod shuffle amongst other prizes and the client/friend wins a new logo to get their company started.
$100 for a professional logo ain't that bad huh?
I figured the arguments would being within the first 10 comments and I was right, comment #7 starts it off. Alan says:
So, you're basically looking for a cheap logo? $100 bucks or so? What a nice way to devalue the talent and skill of the design profession. These kinds of 'competitions' always rub me the wrong way. What it basically comes down to is that your client gets a whole bunch of spec work, and possibly a finished logo, for nearly no money whatsover. You'll forgive me for not participating. The client, and hard working designers everywhere, would be much better served in the end to go to a design professional and pay market rate for services rendered.
A good response came shortly after:
When you are a college student or freelancer wanting experience to build your portfolio, this is perfect. When you are a veteran who has been paid into the thousands for a logo design (which then gets placed on signage, letterheads, billboards, napkins, coasters, etc.) and has a family (not just a gadget budget) then designers begin to think of their work value differently. Obviously this is extremely subjective, and each designer places a very different value on not only their work but the industry. If they think their logo is worth an iPod and that makes them happy, awesome. This discussion has gone on since before Saul Bass and Raymond Loewy. One student's contest is another designer's paycheck. It's how you view the reward.
I tend to side more with the second comment. It's easy for professionals who already get paid to scream and holler about the devaluing of design, but what about putting a value on developing new business opportunities? With this contest you win, you get exposure, a new piece to your portfolio, prizes, and possibly word of mouth from the company hosting the contest. What value is that?
Maybe having a contest with an actual company involved wasn't the best approach, but how much does it hurt the value of design? I think it's a balance that some of us tend to forget about.
Sometimes you just want to design for the love of it and have fun with it. That's what competitions do, they bring out the best of us. Do you think contests like this hurt the industry (note: I don't think this little contest will be the downfall of any industry)?
Things to note:
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This kind of stuff happens, period. We all know that, in most cases, you get what you pay for.
Have your first site built by your nephew who discovered front-page over the Christmas holidays. Then when you 'get the web' and it's potential, come and talk to me ;-) haha.
Same thing with a logo.
This doesn't devalue the industry - the low-rate folks are always gonna be there, and really what is said in the second excerpted comment above and your point on balance are enough to close this one, I think.
Mike P. (http://www.fiftyfoureleven.com/)
Well, to be honest, there are PLENTY of college students and what not who are damn good at what they do, but at that age and education, may not know they can be charging thousands for the logo. Hell, some of these kids are better then the professionals that do charge that kind of money, they just have no connections and/or need to start up their portfolio.
I say, with all due respect, fuck those that bitch and complain about these types of contests. If someone wants to put out that offer, then great, good for whoever is able to win it. First off, having the contest go through airbag industries is going to promote quality work. Its not as simple as some kid opening up photoshop or illustrator for the first time and saying, "hey, there is a contest, I wanna enter and win that Ipod".
Chances are, they aren't going to win, but at least it gets their creative juices flowing.
If you ever go to sitepointforums.com, they have contests ranging from free hosting to $700. And the work displayed at sitepoint, IMO, is damn good.
Good for Airbag Industries, I am glad.
I really enjoyed it when you had those redesign contests going on. Though I never participated, its still cool as hell seeing those that participated and their work, and the prizes were what, a couple books and maybe a small program. But people enjoyed working on them. Same goes for logos.
Bryan (http://www.juicedthoughts.com)
Greg saw it as a fun opportunitiy, not a chance to exploit his audience.
That was my intent, my how some people take things the wrong way.
Greg Storey (http://www.airbagindustries.com)
When Greg first started this contest, it had a deadline of one day. I thought that was a great idea and showed that Greg was sincere about this being a short, fun contest that would maybe be an opportunity for a student, or a new freelancer to get noticed. I'm guessing a professional graphic artist would probably have had projects to work on, so he wouldn't have been able to enter Greg's contest.
But now the deadline has (unexplainedly) been extending to a whole month, and, well, I just imagine a professional firm will grab this up, and there won't be any discovery of new talent or whatever other ideal notions people have presented.
david gouch (http://freepgs.com/individed)
As a designer who has just started out, I think contests are fabulous. They level the playing field and give opportunities that I perhaps would never get at the start of my career.
Like the Boxes and Arrows redesign contest...nobody would have asked me to design that site with 10 months of experience. But with a contest I got a chance. Or for that matter...the Version 2 IMDB contest which saw a huge surge in my site stats.
A chance to show his skills, build a portfolio, get to be "visible"...its all that a new designer wants.
Chugs (http://chugsdesigns.com)
Any designer who is worried about other designers who will design a logo for $99 has confidence issues. The market *always* decides how much you're worth... no matter what industry you're in.
If you're not in the "$99 logo design market", then don't worry about it. If you're good, you're charging 4 or 5 digits.
Mike D. (http://www.mikeindustries.com)
Mike P. allded to it above, but my take is that there is while cries of "devaluing design" might be well-intentioned, they're useless. No matter how much designers bitch, there's always going to be someone willing to do the job for less than you. There's always going to be clipart-toting logo "creators" and MS Frontpage web "designers" and so on. There's nothing we can do about it. We have only two choices:
1. Ignore them and focus on the decent-paying jobs (of which there are plenty).
2. Price our work to compete.
Of course, number two would be devaluing the design market. So, let the up-and-comers (not that I really count myself too far from this category), students, interns, and blokes who just really, really want an iPod shuffle but their bitch won't let them buy one participate in this contest while you do some real work and/or sip magaritas on the beach with all your loot from the last job.
Oh, and lighten the eff up, already. :)
Jeff Croft (http://jeffcroft.com)
If not for cheap clients, I wouldn't be a designer today (and I think that is true for a lot of people).
I built my first site as a professional for $500. Was it a fair price? Maybe. But I didn't know any better, and the client probably wasn't willing to pay me any more.
Contest like this are unquestionably a good idea. And when the awards are relatively cheap (like an iPod Shuffle), it keeps established professionals from entering the contest and crushing the competition.
John Zeratsky (http://johnzeratsky.com)
Someone wants to buy a logo for $99. Anybody selling?
Pardon my naivete, but isn't this just capitalism at work?
seth (http://thegeeklystandard.com)
Shit, $500 as a beginner. For people I have a decent relationship (i.e; friends, family, etc...) $500 is about as high as I go. I am willing to bump it to maybe $1500 (though I have yet to work with a client willing to pay that high :)), but I am starting to set my prices higher.
My first goal, of 2005, is to create an updated portfolio site with new branding and what not.
Bryan (http://www.juicedthoughts.com)
It's all a matter of priorities, just like you said, and its up to the individual. Some people will want the experience and do a design, while others are just as right to express their distaste for the process. To say that it "devalues" design is to ignore the definition of value. If they have a contest where the prize is a $100 iPod (and some experience and exposure), and they get NO entries, well, that's given them an idea that a piece of design is more valuable than that. If all they get is bad entries, well, that's an indicator of value as well. Something is only worth what someone will pay for it. Like Seth says, this is just capitalism at work. Don't hate the player. Hate the game.
kadavy (http://www.kadavy.net)
I've never quite understood why there's an argument over this. Like others here have said already, these kinds of contests are great exposure/experience for some while others will find it beneath them. As far as I'm concerned, these contests can only serve to provide an outlet for those who would never have found one otherwise.
Eric (http://www.osterhoudt.net/)
This is a big issue in the whole design industry, not just here in shape of a logo contest. When there are too many designers and too little clients, the clients that actually have a job to contract can put more pressure on the industry. I've had people asking me if I can do a logo for 70 bucks, because "otherwise we have a student that can do it for free". Fine. Let the student do the job. He gets exposure and the client gets a logo for free. Everyone is happy.
The problem with this scenario is just that it is undermining the business value of our industry. If all students and up-comming designers would value their own work a bit more, we would see a fair level of business and a higher level of design in general. When it comes down to it - everyone can do a logo using micro$oft word and arial black. But somewhere we have to draw the line.
So stop selling yourself too cheap - if not for your own sake than for the industry in general. Only we can force the employers to put higher value into the designers work.
David (http://www.monc.se)
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#1
You need to use double-quotes on each side of that first link... it's causing everything to appear as a link, at least in Firefox/Win.
David Barrett (http://dave.antidisinformation.com/)