May 06, 2004 | View Comments (20) | Category: Our Thoughts
Summary: When does a blog stop becoming just yours and start to become the community's?
There are professors in college who love to just lecture. Lecture, lecture, lecture. This leads to sleep, sleep, sleep. They enjoy the fact that they control the medium of communication. They love the fact that they control the transportation of knowledge. These types of classes never worked for me. If you do not get me involved, you do not get my mind involved.
On the flipside you have professors who enjoy having everyone circle up for an open discussion about the given topic. These types of classes are both engaging and thought provoking (if moderated correctly). Obviously I enjoy these classes because they force me to think if I wish to join the discussion (which is a good reason to comment on sites). The professor doesn't treat the class like it is his own, but acts more as a facilitator. He begins and ends the discussion. He has a chance to learn just as much as his students and therefore takes the same amount of satisfaction as the power-hungy professor.
Blogs fit under the same two categories.
For example let's take a look at John Gruber's site. John writes some killer entries and sometimes sparks controversy around the web. However, he lacks comments on his site so there are no discussions going on. His blog is clearly his own. I am sure he receives a large amount of feedback through email and sometimes through trackbacks, but he would probably gain a little more feedback if he opened up his comments.
I don't care if he has them opened or not, I was just using him as an example of someone who controls their blog. Big ups to you John.
To me what makes or breaks many blogs is the discussions that follow the entry. Comments can either further justify the entry or clearly dispute it. In any case you learn when you get to hear all sides of an argument (that are hopefully well presented). This blog is the circle-around discussion type blog. The point I would like to make though is that this is no longer just my blog.
Now before you go off saying that anything created by the person writing is that person's property let me try to explain.
Over time I have come to rely on everyone's opinions on matters ranging from design to project management to business. In return I am sure you expect quality content to come from the site. It's a balance. I expect, you expect.
When I redesign some people like it, some people hate it. From a design standpoint the site is mine. I make it look however I want it to look. However, from the content perspective I see it as equal sharing. I merely just start the topics. This is what I mean when I say the blog is not mine, but ours.
Now let's say I start offering lower grade content or close all comments, then do you think I am doing a disservice to the Whitespace community? I think so and I think people have every right to get mad. The community helped to build this site so they have the right to feel they have a stake in it.
To be honest I think it just comes down to why you blog. I like to use everyone. I like to use their knowledge so I can learn. This site is merely a ploy for you to transfer all your knowledge to me and it seems to be working. So I think you have a right to feel you part of the site. Just remember I will always control at least 51% of it :-)
I think too many times you see bloggers expect something from their readers, but do not return those expectations equally. Some times you get the "this is my site" attitude and when that shows I think it really hurts the site. Successful sites are built around the people who use them. Jason Fried likes to talk about focusing on the people. Keith is starting to focus more on the users as well.
I have 3 ways to achieve a successful blog:
I think I miss 1 completely and fall short on 2, so I had to place my focus on 3. So far so good. If you start a site and you expect something from your readers then don't be surprised when they expect something back. Give them something and they will give something in return. Some people look for the magic formula to building successful blogs (or any website) and there isn't one. Its simple. Stop thinking of the site as your own and make it everyone's. You are just the caretaker.
Trackback URL: http://9rules.com/cgi-bin/mt/mt-tb.cgi/229
You hit the nail on the head Paul.
When I plan on starting up my blog, I will definitly be talking about some controversial subjects since the focus of my blog has to do with life in general and all the BS that goes on around us. I will also have almost all of my posts open to comments since I want reader feedback. I am not one to get into verbal fights or cut/put the other person down. My blog will be a place for constructive criticism and mature discussion. If people want to start ranting and raving, I will do the appropriate thing for my audience, and that is to remove his/her post.
I want my future community to gain a cyber relationship with me as their friend, as someone they can go to and read my thoughts and hopefully open their minds up to different things. Just like you have done with whitespace and all of its followers :).
I am hoping my blog will become as popular as yours one day. It just takes time.
Bryan (http://www.gamecubecheats.info)
Mark you are right about being intimidated with difficult to understand material. However, I think an important skill for a professor (or blogger) to possess is taking the difficult subjects and making them easy to understand.
People can be scared to offer input because they may feel they do not fully grasp the subject. If the professor can explain it so they understand then discussion should flow more readily. However, there are just some topics that people will never discuss and will only walk out of class with their friends thinking “What the hell was that?”
Bryan, this blog only seems popular because I post 20 comments myself in each entry :-P
The web is about knowledge and people. Focus on the best way to transfer that knowledge to the people who read your site. Find a way to create a flow of knowledge that everyone can share and you should find yourself with a successful site.
Scrivs (http://www.9rules.com/whitespace/)
I agree and disagree with you on your 3 ways to have a successful blog.
I think that working for a successful company does increase your chances of having a successful blog. This is especially true if your company is involved in the media industry. If you don't think so take a look at all the folks over at TechTV.
And as far as how well the design is constructed, how much time was put into it and the overall appearance of it; once again look at the folks over at TechTV. Though the content may be solid, well written, and well formed, the designs on many fall short on what I would consider to be visually appealing.
And the one that I agree wholeheartedly on is to focus on the people. That is the best advice you can give to anyone designing on any kind of site. When you focus on the viewer, and especially focus on the "type" of viewer that you intend to draw in, then that is success.
You are unlikely to setup a site to have comments on a site where you are presenting a biased opinion which is intended by the author to be perceived as fact. But on a site such as this, it is apparent to have open discussion. It allows users to freely exchange ideas and their own views on the topic at hand. This is important on a site like this which is a focused on a community and a fan base which is always open to new ideas.
Ryan (http://www.destroyhope.org)
/me likes to think it is all about content.
(And the fun /I/ have in it, but perhaps that sounds a bit egocentric.)
Anne (http://annevankesteren.nl/)
I've always likened my site to a 'Ma and Pop' store. It's always open for business, friendly and overall good conversation and observation takes place. However, like most 'Ma and Pop' shops the traffic (or customers) is nothing compared to that of the leading corporate stores.
There are thousands (or hundreds, whatever) blogs across the world wide web. Everyone has a voice and an opinion towards a particular topic. Some of these sites have a decent-sized reader base while others are lucky to get a few visitors every so often.
I agree with something Anil Dash once said, most blogs are personal projects (diaries, logs) whose scope is meant to reach family, friends, co-workers etc.
If someone is distraught over the lack of comments on their blog they could always adopt various personas (Bob, Mary, Jane, Tim, etc.) and post comments as if there were other people.
Or, just do what Paul does and post 20 comments in each entry. That works as well.
;)
kartooner (http://www.kartooner.com)
Well Anne if you aren't having fun why post? When you are having fun I think it shows in your content. It shows the passion and energy you put into something and people tend to feed off of that.
Ryan, you are correct and I should have explained those better. I meant to say to get a "start" at having a successful blog you could do one of these 3 steps.
Scrivs (http://www.9rules.com/whitespace/)
I would further qualify your 3 ways to:
1. Do currently or have worked for a large, well-known company in a visible and prominent position.
Just because you were the mailboy at Microsoft doesn't guarantee you much ;)
2. Provide killer products / services that people gawk over.
There are plenty of successful blogs which have absolutely nothing to do with web development. Additionally, as has been talked across many blogs, there are a number of highly successful sites that are absolutely hideous to look at.
3. Focus on the people who get it.
As you stated in your response to my previous, "explain it so they understand" - doing that can only go so far until you start losing the target audience. They'll get the impression you are talking down to them in order to get the handful who quite aren't there with you on the same page.
Mark (http://www.lightpierce.com/ltshdw)
Now that you have reiterated what you had said previously, I am no longer having mixed feelings about what you said. I am agreeing with you completely on this.
If you do pick at least one of the three, and continue to follow through with it, in time you will have what could be perceived as a successful blog. The way you originally stated it as if you do one of these three in the beginning it will become an overnight success. Along with you have to do absolutely all three of these, and I just couldn't see that as being anywhere close to true.
Ryan (http://www.destroyhope.org)
I am hoping to learn a lot from this topic! It sounds right to me what you are saying Scrivs, but I don't think just anyone can turn it on or off, or find a formula to increase participation. Some people have the knack of saying things which encourage response and some people (like me but I hope I am getting better) close off discussions. I used to be a bit of a "know it all" and perhaps some of that still creeps in because I am opinionated and don't mind stating my opinions - people can take them or leave them. I expect people to be as opinionated or outspoken as me, but perhaps that view does not encourage response.
And there's also the open-ended question technique that I probably can't master, so I close things instead of opening up discussion.
I often have different views than the mainstream and I don't think that helps either as people maybe can't quite relate to me.
So there are 3 barriers that I perceive get in the way of free flowing communication for me. But does that help anyone? And did I say it in such a way that it might help, or has it turned you off?
Peter
Turned me off instantly. Just joking ;-) What many bloggers lack is patience. They do expect that people will flock to their site and the comments will start to fly in. In fact it takes time. For some people it may be months while for other it takes years. In any case just make sure to just write.
It funny because many times I will write an entry thinking if I should end it with a question or not. I usually do so when I am not sure my point has gotten across to everyone. Other time it just seems silly to finish with a question.
Some topics offer better discussions than others. When I post a non-scientific poll asking for people's quick opinions the comments fly just because. Other times some discussions start slow and end slow.
Scrivs (http://www.9rules.com/whitespace/)
Everyone lacks patience when it comes to their website, and you are right, those of the blogging community in particular. Everyone expects that you throw together a decent layout, and slap any old content in there, that they should have a thousand hits as soon as it's complete.
The number one thing that they get misconstrued is that everyone will find them. True; Google, and Yahoo are powerful tools, but they do not find you viewers, it's the content.
It seems too often that people do get lazy and forget that instead of letting people find them, they can go out and find people. So many times is this underused, and overlooked.
Finding your own visitors is a great way to get noticed in a relatively short amount of time. It could take months on months to actually see substantial traffic coming in from search engines and referrals. Do some actual work, and find your own audience.
I am doing it right now. I have just recently re-launched my site which is targeted at the design community. I know that finding people of similar interests and giving them a chance to get exposed to that could be a great way to get noticed.
You are absolutely right; people expect too much traffic right away. They do not see the potential exposure by comments, forums, and other communication sources overlooked. But in the end it does come down to just writing, and a bit of what I said too. Self promotion, self exposure, and doing something yourself rather than letting others do it for you.
Ryan (http://www.destroyhope.org)
People can be scared to offer input because they may feel they do not fully grasp the subject. If the professor can explain it so they understand then discussion should flow more readily. However, there are just some topics that people will never discuss and will only walk out of class with their friends thinking “What the hell was that?”
Welcome to my world. :)
I'd say more successful sites are the ones that promote community. Look at Daliy Kos. It's so community oriented that you can sign with with the blog to have your own blog (they call it a diary), and as such it has become a hugh site.
But then again I suppose it depends ;) on how you define success. Is it many comments, many visitors, or making someones job easier because you posted something that is going to help them immensly.
I'll take what's behind door number three.
Matthew Oliphant (http://usabilityworks.typepad.com)
"Some topics offer better discussions than others." They do, and content is crucial, but your lecturer can't get people involved even though I bet his content is very interesting.
Perhaps it seems silly using a question at times, Scrivs, but the way you write encourages questions and responses nevertheless. Trying not to sound like I am brown nosing here, but there is something in your style of writing, your approach to the topic, your slant or whatever that we need to discover. Because it evidently works.
But then again, before your head swells too much, it is not your blog, it is everyone's, and there are many great contributions. So perhaps you're just lucky to to be in the right place at the right time! Yeah, sheer fluke!
Peter
So perhaps you're just lucky to to be in the right place at the right time! Yeah, sheer fluke!
No argument here. This site is run by the comments. The hardest part is coming up with topics that I think will generate the interest of the readers and myself. If it doesn't interest me first then I will not write about it and if I don't think it serves any purpose to anyone else I try to stay away from it.
I think part of why this site is successful is because of the transparency that I offer. Kind of a what you see is what you get type thing.
Scrivs (http://www.9rules.com/whitespace/)
Although, the class room analogy can only go so far. It is really nice to have a community and to liken a blog to a conversation, but a blog is still a web log, not a instant messenger conversation/telephone call/class room debate.
The point being that I think people want to learn what the blogger is thinking and what interesting ideas they have.
I think a discussion board is somewhat better organized for discussions (gee, really, that's a brilliant assumption).
Blog's are nice to put your two cents in (1 cent for me) but they lack the reciprocation and immediate progression or denial of a discussion path.
It is a really unique form of discussion, with similarities and differences to other forms.
I agree with what you say, but it is worth really analysing the flow of blog comments or blomments (2nd cent).
Heath Weaver (http://wbmny.com)
"I think part of why this site is successful is because of the transparency that I offer. Kind of a what you see is what you get type thing."
That, and consistency.
Mike P. (http://www.fiftyfoureleven.com.com/sandbox/weblog/)
Why are you validating at xhtml/trans? You're only two errors away from strict!
David House (http://xmouse.ithium.net)
Hi! Wow! Yippee! Fantastico! I love your website! Spam! Spam Spam. Just send me all your money! I will be your friend! Thank you Thank you!
And send me all your friends money too! Thank you Thank you!
Sheesh! Sorry Scrivs, couldn't resist it.
Peter (http://www.01010.org/)
congrats mate! Fine job and fine site!
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#1
I think, continuing with the classroom example, that there is another way to look at it.
I've had instructors who have been more facilitators who have used the class time to open discussion and everyone learns - as you point out. From my experience, this is great, when I understood and felt confident in my knowledge of the subject matter. In other classes, where I felt I had no real clue - I just wished the instructor would talk, and leave any expectation of my verbal involvement out of the possibility.
You could approach this thought with certain blogs as well. You have your more popular sites which are moderated by experts or well known "celebrity" types in their respective fields. I've seen a number of these sites not be open to comments, but rather show the sites linking to the story via trackback. I think this provides, in some instances, a less intimitading venue in which to comment on a post, without feeling as though you've wasted your host's (moderator's) screen / server space.
To bring it back to the classroom. In those classes in which the material is hard to conceive or the moderator's knowledge is intimidating for most folks, you get much more "honest" discussion about it after class is over and folks are making their way out the door then you do during the actual class or presentation.
Mark (http://www.lightpierce.com/ltshdw)